tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post522227895761363137..comments2023-10-08T16:32:25.031-04:00Comments on Exlcblog: This is Really Getting BAD!Exlcbloggerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15255210441204241907noreply@blogger.comBlogger53125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-79524437244297261002009-08-30T14:44:54.958-04:002009-08-30T14:44:54.958-04:00"I have no doubt there is much more to the st..."I have no doubt there is much more to the story..."<br /><br />That's what our mutual friend said when I mentioned the discrepancy, but he would not tell me more out of respect for ER. Moreover, as a canon lawyer I have encountered several credible and not uncommon situations where something happens like the situation ER describes. And let's not forget that ExLC, who tends to be in the know about these things, has vouched that he's been in touch with ER, and that his story checks out. (After ER stated on several occasions that he worked with ExLC in the Legion).<br /><br />So the story checks out.Pete Verehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10114005098316164699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-30594298947408247842009-08-30T12:00:54.198-04:002009-08-30T12:00:54.198-04:00Thank you, Pete.
So which "who he says he is...Thank you, Pete.<br /><br />So which "who he says he is" are we going with? The ER who was thrown out of the Legionaries in 2003 or the ER who is currently in Rome, part of the Legionary Underground? That's a pretty major discrepancy.<br /><br />I have no doubt there is much more to the story, and I wish ER (whoever he is) healing and peace, but I'm afraid nothing he posts here again will really be believable considering he is posting different stories in different places.<br /><br />Be well, ER, SP, whoever you are. I truly do hope for nothing but peace for you. May God grant you healing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-27059439164395473482009-08-30T10:15:43.850-04:002009-08-30T10:15:43.850-04:00Concerning ER - I too wondered initially whether E...Concerning ER - I too wondered initially whether ER was SP from the AmP blog (Sorry for the alphabet soup, folks!) After all, their mindset and writing styles contain many similarities. However, other discrepancies rule this out. SP claimed to be living in America with his wife and children, if I recall correctly, while ER states that he's a priest in Rome. (Please, given the fragile emotional state to which ER admits to being in, no jokes about following the charism of the founder.)<br /><br />Additionally, a mutual friend has vouched for ER and explained the situation to me privately. This friend has spent years helping Maciel's victims seek justice, and his information has always checked out. So I'm inclined to believe ER is who he says he is.Pete Verehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10114005098316164699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-38611208679788708582009-08-30T08:37:51.565-04:002009-08-30T08:37:51.565-04:00ER,
Are you Sand Pounder?
(Those of you who ha...ER,<br /><br />Are you Sand Pounder? <br /><br />(Those of you who have been regulars over at AmP since the story broke in Feb will know who I am talking about.)<br /><br />I do worry about you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-55045707522132281612009-08-30T08:28:59.862-04:002009-08-30T08:28:59.862-04:00So?
Edmond Ritter.So?<br />Edmond Ritter.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-92223870863817649042009-08-30T07:16:40.060-04:002009-08-30T07:16:40.060-04:00The point is, Edmond, that you posted that you had...The point is, Edmond, that you posted that you had been "thrown out" of the Legion in 2003. And that you were glad the Legion was no longer your problem, "It's amazing to see that non Legionaries should even want to stick their nose and comment in what is not their business. It was my business. Now it is not. I am quite happy about it."<br /><br />To my knowledge, the Legion does not take people back in who have been thrown out by Maciel. So you were either lying on Rod Dreher's page or are lying here.<br /><br />I think it's apparent that you are in pretty rough shape emotionally/psychologically, and I pray you get the help you need. <br /><br />It's probably safe to say that your credibility will be practically nil here now that it's been shown that you have been lying on the comboxes. Is this some sort of game for you? Do you think we are that stupid? Did you learn that well from Maciel, the master of deception?<br /><br />I wish you well, but please don't waste our time with rambling illogical commentaries that we now know are very likely based on falsehood. Your posts full of lies are non-existent to me now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-60355975008912014032009-08-30T00:31:53.446-04:002009-08-30T00:31:53.446-04:00I hold that it's not impossible that MM is not...I hold that it's not impossible that MM is not in hell. He was simply too out of his mind to be fully aware of what he was doing, for whatever reason that drove him, call it DID or diabolical possession. If I wrote simply that MM was immaculate, had zero culpability, it must be out of context. To claim him immaculate is at least as strong as saying that he is absolutely and necessarily in hell. We human beings cannot know either state unless God reveals it. I don't recall writing that statement, but if I did, it would be reacting to the over-the-top negativity in the comments in general. I do not deny that much evil was done here in the LC, but to not acknowledge that there are good people too, to cast such blanket condemnations of the whole on account of the part, seems to me, as I said elsewhere, a touch Marcielian - that's what MM used to do and I hated it. Justice calls for punishing the evildoers, not the evildoers and innocent together. Edmond RitterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-14777529315638712472009-08-29T22:48:58.793-04:002009-08-29T22:48:58.793-04:00To: Anonymous poster (Aug. 29, 8:54 pm)
Thanks fo...To: Anonymous poster (Aug. 29, 8:54 pm)<br /><br />Thanks for sending us to http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2009/02/maciel-partisanship-and-blindn_comments.html so we can read the Feb. 5th post from a certain Edmund Ritter. He states: "I believe [MM] is rather the victim of abuse than a deliberate abuser of others. Probably there is zero culpability on his part."<br /><br />Sounds like someone is still brainwashed to me...<br /><br />Nearly Two Decades of LiesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-55152782275097686562009-08-29T20:54:28.201-04:002009-08-29T20:54:28.201-04:00Edmond,
Are you the same "Edmund Ritter&quo...Edmond, <br /><br />Are you the same "Edmund Ritter" (I do note the o vs. the u spelling) who posted on Rod Dreher's blog back in February? (http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2009/02/maciel-partisanship-and-blindn_comments.html)<br /><br />I'm asking because THAT "Edmund Ritter" speaks of having been "thrown out" (his words, not mine) of the Legion in 2003. That Edmund Ritter also proposes, at length, the hypothesis of Dissociative Identity Disorder as having been an explanation for MM's behavior. And vehemently denies the credibility of accusations of pedophilia while pointing out that there have been ex-legionaries out to get Maciel for many years.<br /><br />I know that others here have vouched for your existence, but I don't know if anybody has vouched for your existence as a CURRENT Legionary? <br /><br />I'm not trying to be mean here, just trying to make sense of this. Are there TWO Edmond Ritters who believe Maciel had DID?<br />Or are you just having fun with us in trying to portray yourself as somebody still within the order trying to make changes?<br /><br />Whoever you are, please know that you are in my prayers. I do not doubt that you have been through terrible abuse at the hands of Maciel's organization.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-27498750378219326412009-08-29T09:52:30.568-04:002009-08-29T09:52:30.568-04:00ER wrote: "This stuff of a priest-founder bei...ER wrote: "This stuff of a priest-founder being an insane pederast monster -- which he was -- is child's play compared to the antics of popes and kings back then."<br /><br />However, you should also view this through the perspective of the peasant. Blogs, demands for apostolic visitation, and CNN interviews also were not possible technologically back then. So when the clergy reached a particle level of corruption, out came the pitch and pitchforks.Pete Verehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10114005098316164699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-4466146435542487102009-08-29T07:25:54.795-04:002009-08-29T07:25:54.795-04:00That's mere common sense, Fr Michael. The lead...That's mere common sense, Fr Michael. The leadership needs a thorough psychiatric analysis to explain to me what they have been doing the last 15 plus years. A mere police investigation and general audit will not cut it.<br />ER<br />PS Do I know you Fr. Michael?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-37712477384139031472009-08-29T03:30:20.056-04:002009-08-29T03:30:20.056-04:00Barring heavenly intervention and some LC leadersh...Barring heavenly intervention and some LC leadership behind bars for conspiracy, I sadly suspect that the Legion will continue in some form. <br /><br />But I tell you what, any parent that would allow his minor son to enter an LC seminary from here on out is feeding the monster. Orthodox parents: don't count on Rome to protect your sons, do it yourself! <br /><br />FrMichaelAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-5693032853650721902009-08-29T03:10:27.218-04:002009-08-29T03:10:27.218-04:00Thanks for the last posts. A little knowledge of C...Thanks for the last posts. A little knowledge of Church History would help to put things in perspective. If we lived during the "Iron Century", that's what my Church History professor called the 900s, we would be much more inclined to call the 1900s a Golden Age for the Papacy. This stuff of a priest-founder being an insane pederast monster -- which he was -- is child's play compared to the antics of popes and kings back then. And I would not be surprised if from heaven, in about a thousands years' time, we can all agree that we were in fact living in a golden age of the Church. I recommend a tranquil reading of old Church History to chill out a little.<br />Thanks for the perspective go to the last two posts.<br />Edmond RitterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-73119133225880849562009-08-28T21:43:28.990-04:002009-08-28T21:43:28.990-04:00I'm the one who posted the comment ending with...I'm the one who posted the comment ending with the Belloc quote "Wherever the Catholic sun..." Thanks for clarifying your views, I see exactly where you're coming from and am sympathetic to what you're saing. I especially like the last post. There IS a curious kind of "hyper orthodoxy" around these days that treats modern popes as infallible in every way, rather than within the narrow strictures posited by Church teaching. <br /><br />When I was in seminary (I am a priest 21 years ordained)one of the best bishops in Canada gave us a talk and said something memorable. "Men" he said "the Church is made up of essential and non-essential elements. The problem with much of the Catholic left is that they treat essentials as non-essentials. And the problem with much of the Catholic right is that they treat non-essentials as essentials." <br /><br />We seem to have a lot of well meaning folks who think everything a given pope says or does is an essential element of the Church and hence beyond criticism and question. Not a very healthy attitude, especially in this day and age. We need to become a people who can intelligently question, criticize and even protest within the rather wide parameters the essential elements of the Church set for us.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-2916819297296419772009-08-28T20:48:19.195-04:002009-08-28T20:48:19.195-04:00"In likening the church to the legion I merel..."In likening the church to the legion I merely meant that the complicity that seems to have been necessay by members of the magesterium to allow this situation to have gotten to this point is practically criminal, moral judgements aside. What that does or doesn't mean to a catholic about trusting the the Vatican for guidance moving forward seem to be relevant questions (not my place to even propose a direction on that).<br /><br />Also, hit the nail on the head as to my lack of diplomacy! I'm pretty awful on that front. I'm not a jerk, I just never got a knack for saying things accessibly. We all have our various faults that hold us back!"<br /><br />I'm completely with you here. I have definitely been questioning my trust in the Vatican from this point forward, as I would imagine many of us are. This whole incident has forcefully reminded me of the fact that just because a pope says it, doesn't make it so.<br /><br />Some years ago I began to wonder why it is that nowadays it is practically heretical in many Catholics' eyes to question the Pope's judgment, or even his morality in decision-making. I mean, we KNOW from history that we have had Popes who were rogues, cads, whore-mongerers, probably even murderers. Why do we think we are SO very special nowadays that we might not have a Pope who could do some serious damage in our Church? (whether intentionally or not). Why are we so shocked at the notion of a Vatican full of corruption? Why do we seem to check our brains and critical-thinking ability at the door when it comes to Popes?<br /><br />I respect the office of president of our great country. I don't always like or agree with the person holding that office. That doesn't mean I am not passionately patriotic about my country. Why can't it be the same with Popes? Unless speaking in very specific situations, Popes are fallible, too. Where does it say we have to like them or agree with everything they say? <br /><br />Re: being a jerk. Nah.....I wouldn't call you that. So perhaps your tact needs a little work; nobody's perfect.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-51639807681908952992009-08-28T19:26:07.463-04:002009-08-28T19:26:07.463-04:00I wasn't commenting on the deceptions of macie...I wasn't commenting on the deceptions of maciel bearing on Jesus himself. I was trying to point to similarities between the institutional thinking within the lc and the thinking within the church. In both cases it seems to me that too many things are taken for granted by members as untouchable or unquestionable and that this tends to inhibit the outing of truths, lies and misconceptions.<br /><br />I did not mean that I feel pity for anyone who believes other than me. The hubris in a mindset like that is overwhelming. What I meant is that I pity those who cling to things such as the rc/lc talking points, or really any other argument that stands on authority alone to the point of killing off their ability to be intellectually honest.<br /><br />In likening the church to the legion I merely meant that the complicity that seems to have been necessay by members of the magesterium to allow this situation to have gotten to this point is practically criminal, moral judgements aside. What that does or doesn't mean to a catholic about trusting the the Vatican for guidance moving forward seem to be relevant questions (not my place to even propose a direction on that).<br /><br />Also, hit the nail on the head as to my lack of diplomacy! I'm pretty awful on that front. I'm not a jerk, I just never got a knack for saying things accessibly. We all have our various faults that hold us back!Aizonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-16049958064850940172009-08-28T18:48:56.568-04:002009-08-28T18:48:56.568-04:00Though I understand the underlying logic of compar...Though I understand the underlying logic of comparing the Catholic Church as a whole to the LC/RC, I don't agree with it and believe that it is based on flawed premises.<br /><br />Even if one does not believe he is the Son of God, I'm not sure how one could equate Jesus of Nazareth with Marcial. As well, to compare a religion that is two thousand years old with a movement that is not even a century in age is problematic.<br /><br />If one accepts what Jesus and the New Testament have to say about the Church, than one must expect that it will contain the very best, and the very worst that humanity has to offer. It is the field where wheat and weeds grow up together, the net that catches every sort of fish, etc. There are deep blemishes in her history, but she has, throughout that history, produced giants of virtue. People who in the common perception of humanity deserve to be called "saints". This while preserving the learning of the Grec-Roman world, founding the first hospitals and universities, and in general, creating Western Civilization (how many of the P.C. crowd would want to live under Shari'a law, deal with Hindu prejudices reagding women and caste, or conform to the very non-individualistic norms of Confucian societies?).<br /><br />She may be flawed and governed with "knavish imbecility" in her humanity, but she's the only church we were given (with all due respect to the 3200 Christian denominations that fiil the American religious landscape).<br /><br />Belloc once said "Wherever the Catholic sun doth shine, there's plebty of laughter and good red wine. Benedicamus Domine!" Let's laugh a little more (otherwise we'll have to cry)>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-61318546204754607912009-08-28T17:33:00.695-04:002009-08-28T17:33:00.695-04:00So I take it you left the Church, Aizo?
I don&#...So I take it you left the Church, Aizo? <br /><br />I don't blame anybody who does. However, I do still believe Jesus is God, which is not at all parallel to believing Maciel the deviant to be a saint. And I believe the Church was founded by Christ, who was NOT deviant or evil in any way.<br /><br />I guess if I am wrong, I will have to eat crow when I die. In the meantime, I will continue to try to live up to the ideals Christ preached.<br /><br />As far as the offense you seemed to take about the "circular" thinking, the LOL was meant to indicate I was being tongue-in-cheek.<br /><br />I'm sorry that your 5 years in NH seems to have left you feeling pity for all those who believe other than you do. You may not intend ill will, but you do come across as quite rude. That's probably why you get yelled at so much. ROFL!<br /><br />Some people are better than others at diplomacy---online and elsewhere. Obviously it's not your strong point.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-61982698673478232332009-08-28T15:43:43.132-04:002009-08-28T15:43:43.132-04:00From the last poster:
"It simply MUST have Go...From the last poster:<br />"It simply MUST have God's protection (gates of hell won't prevail against it, and all that). There's no other explanation for its survival."<br /><br />That's ridiculous, circular logic! The survival of the church is based on people like yourself believing in it and passing it on to future generations.<br /><br />It's very hard for a religious tradition to die out as shown by the many of you who arrive at this site to discuss one of the clearest examples of the pure humanity of the catholic church and still overlook that fact.<br /><br />I view attitudes such as that which you have expressed towards the catholic church (I'm not trying to pick on one person, it's a prevalent attitude in these comboxes) in the same way that you all seem to view the attitudes of the die-hard RC and LC who do not accept the naked truths about who MM truly was and what the real purposes of his institutions were. You all express both exasperation and pity for those who still cannot break away from what they have been told to believe, how they have been bred to think about LC and MM despite clear evidence to the contrary. I feel that in the midst of discussing these tragic circumstances you all seem like fish pitying figures in a snowglobe, who don't realize that they themselves are in a tank.<br /><br />I want to make clear that I mean no ill will by this post. I just wanted to point out a parallel that is so apparent in the hopes that you will consider it with some intellectual honesty. My motto has always been that the one who has the truth has no fear of ideas. I only mention this to illustrate that my attitude is not hostile (I'm used to being yelled at for this kind of thing).<br /><br />Also, not some rando coming to spam your boards and take advantage of your situation. I was in NH for 5 years.aizonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-51564190752249245182009-08-28T14:59:43.656-04:002009-08-28T14:59:43.656-04:00I don't mind in the least that Kennedy receive...I don't mind in the least that Kennedy received a Catholic funeral (I'm glad he did and hope God grants him eternal peace), but it does burn my Catholic bum that the media covered it so lavishly, giving the appearance that this man was some sort of an exemplary Catholic. THAT is what ticks me off. <br /><br />Back to the Church. My biggest reason for believing it's the true Church is that it has lasted this long---only an organization founded by God could survive this long given all the injustice perpetrated by it and corruption present within it. LOL It simply MUST have God's protection (gates of hell won't prevail against it, and all that). There's no other explanation for its survival.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-76462746414619445692009-08-28T09:10:44.237-04:002009-08-28T09:10:44.237-04:00AS for Ted Kennedy and the Catholic Funeral--- Ed...AS for Ted Kennedy and the Catholic Funeral--- Ed Peters (canon lawyer) says that actually, he fits the requirements, esp. since in his last week or so (after Eunice's death) he spoke with a priest frequently AND received last rites.<br /><br />Remember, the purpose of a Catholic Funeral is NOT to 'celebrate a person's life' or to 'praise their holiness...' It's to PRAY FOR A SINNER and to offer sacrifices...... We never assume someone's in heaven unless they're canonized!<br /><br />So.... think of the funeral as a charitable work by the church, trying to help a poor sinner through purgatory with our prayers.<br /><br />The Maciel mess IS a cause for scandal... but the Kennedy funeral? Not so much. (Unless they money with the rubrics to give the president a platform, but the funeral itself is a GOOD thing...)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-12104606843966009912009-08-28T08:57:49.999-04:002009-08-28T08:57:49.999-04:00Just remember folks that even in the Garden God al...Just remember folks that even in the Garden God allowed the devil to roam.<br /><br />Take a look at the quote from Hillaire Belloc above. So true.<br /><br />Believe it or not the Counsel of Jerusalem threatened to undo the Church way more than this scandal and the other issues of today ever could. Perspective is very important now.<br /><br />God never promised a cakewalk - I believe he said something about a lot of persecution.<br /><br />Pardon my cheery "RC-ness" coming through but hopefully I'm untwisting their distorted messages of "perseverance" (used just to keep members from fleeing) to use for a good end.Still RC - For Now, Anywaynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-84577104201942003962009-08-28T08:06:51.900-04:002009-08-28T08:06:51.900-04:00I am looking at "my" Church and I just s...I am looking at "my" Church and I just said to my husband that if I had somewhere to go I would leave. Sex abuse scandals that get covered up, pro-aborts and adulterers who get a Catholic funeral, a marxist president who exploits the Catholic Church for his sick agenda, a Catholic Church who lets herself exploited for said Marxist's sick agenda, a perderast and fornicator who receives support from the highest ranking clergy in the hierarchy, lies and deception of said pederast's and fornicator's life that are still ongoing, an episcopate without any backbone, an episcopate in outright disobedience to the Holy See........... and on and on and on......<br /><br />It makes me sick!<br /><br />Mercy!<br />Mum26Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-44732614884155491062009-08-28T02:39:57.320-04:002009-08-28T02:39:57.320-04:00It's kind of sad to say this, but agree with t...It's kind of sad to say this, but agree with the previous poster. Well, I can't say that I hope JPII will not be canonized, but I guess I'd have to say I am so disillusioned with the whole thing that I really don't care about what Rome does or does not do. I'm just going to join my parish, go to Mass, maybe even join an RCIA class -- b/c after so many years in the movement I feel like I need to relearn so much -- and just live out my life in simplicity and blissful ignorance. I'm done giving a shit, sorry Father.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7498854344598192644.post-436012258805752492009-08-27T22:36:14.706-04:002009-08-27T22:36:14.706-04:00I have been a priest for 21 years and love the Chu...I have been a priest for 21 years and love the Church and my priesthood. Thank God, I have a good bishop and am in a healthy diocese. Still, I agree with some of the other readers who are skeptical about how much to expect from Rome. The wonderful thing about the doctrine of the Church's infallibility is that, in letting us know when and how the Church is infallible, it let's us know all the times and situations it's not. This AV is not under a guarentee of infallibility and mistakes, poor judgement and downright dishonesty could make the whole thing a waste of time. How helpful Hilaire Belloc was when he said of the Church "An institution run with such knavish imbecility, that were God not behind it, it would have dissapeared in a fortnight."<br /><br /> I met John Paul II and was part of a small group of priests to speak with him. I was once a "fan". Now I find myself hoping he will not be canonized.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com